Wolfpacks 20111022 Alumni and Support
#26
Posted 21 October 2011 - 03:49 PM
MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.
#27
Posted 21 October 2011 - 04:06 PM
Sort of relevant to the ECM discussion although most people are unaware of them are low-grade Jackal implants (IIRC). Rather than reprise a discussion I recommend you go look at Wensley's blog from a few months back, he was looking at the benefits re ECM drones. www.rifterdrifter.com for those who don't know Wensley. I would link directly but his blog doesn't like the Kindle browser I am currently using (I got the 3G one so browsing is free pretty much everywhere bar the US).
Useful implants if you're flying logis/jammers.
For anyone who hasn't come across these, they boost your signal strength, making you harder to jam. Note that they are race specific however, so jackals will only do you any good if you're flying Minmatar ships. So, jammer pilots, you really want to be looking at the Talon set, rather than the Jackal one
#28
Posted 21 October 2011 - 04:11 PM
#29
Posted 21 October 2011 - 04:24 PM
#30
Posted 21 October 2011 - 04:47 PM
I don't think you want to fly into 0.0 in a flimsy ECM boat, in a fleet without Logi support, with such expensive implants in your head.
Ummm they arent expensive Sarek. They are pretty damn cheap TBH.
I guess I differ from a lot of people in that I would rather pimp the clone than the ship. Most times the pod gets out when the ship doesnt....
MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.
#31
Posted 21 October 2011 - 05:02 PM
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11350-open-pvp-avanced-hssr-2300-15th-advanced-2100-for-16th-17th-july/]ADVANCED HSSR -1807102100[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11588-closed-pvp-wolfpacks-class-august-2829-1800/]WOLFPACKS-201008281800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/12728-fullpvp-covops-nov-28-1800-venue-changeread/]COVOPS - 281101800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13477-closed-pvp-skirmish-prototype-class-29th-30th-january-1300/]SKIRMISH-20110129[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13315-closed-pvp-flybys-february-12th-1800/]FLYBYS-20110212[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/16195-closed-stealth-bombers-20111119-2000/]Stealth Bombers 20111119[/link]
#32
Posted 21 October 2011 - 05:22 PM
What we've learned so far:
The only T2 ECM mod you should even consider fitting is the caldari jammer (because the meta 4 version is pricey, particularly in relation to the rest of the fit.) Otherwise, go with meta 4 always (including the low-slot mod) because it rates to be cheaper and is often significantly more useful.
Don't bring multispectral jammers.
Rigs should prolly be 1 each of ecm strength (Medium Particle Dispersion Augmentor I,) ecm range (Medium Particle Dispersion Projector I) and locking range (Medium Ionic Field Projector I.) (That gets you to 100+80 and 117km lock with max skills, which seems pretty damn good to me.)
Fit is 2 signal distortion amplifiers in the lows, 5 jammers and MWD in the mids and 3 HML in the highs.
Meta MWD are better than T2 MWD.
So that just leaves the 4th high-slot. I was planning to fit an autocannon just in case I ended up with drones on me somehow at some point but I see a remote rep as a good idea as well. Maybe even a Medium Nosferatu II! (There's lots of fitting room on this thing.)
Good summary.
As for the highs...ya.
If we are able to stay at range, then even the HMLs to me are useless. I don't think we can go toe-to-toe with anything that comes out to get us, so they're kind of only for when the fight spreads out towards us I suppose. Basically anything that can kill you is going to force you off the field (sneak preview of the ECM guide I'm furiously typing out: you are aligned while jamming. If anything targets you, warp out and bounce back in.) You are all likely better at multitasking than me, but to be honest, with the micromanagement that jamming requires, I rarely use my weapons. In fact, I'm positive I've activated remote reppers more times than I have weapons. Which leads me to almost consider bringing a high-rack full of armor and hull reppers rather than simply losing missile launchers and missiles...
This probably just highlights how bad I am at the game, but to me, it's the jamming that's critical, the DPS is an afterthought. And with the doctrine we're going to try to practice about being out at 70-90, well, there's not a lot out there to shoot at except each other. If there is, we best be in warp.
#33
Posted 21 October 2011 - 05:50 PM
My heavies hit out to 84.4 on EFT so call it 80. And yeah, 84 DPS (I only have spec IV) sounds crappy, but it's ~ half a thrasher. But yeah, if your missile skills aren't top notch, activating your launchers should be an afterthought (as opposed to a distant 2nd priority as they'll be for me) in a 'serious' engagement.Good summary.
As for the highs...ya.
If we are able to stay at range, then even the HMLs to me are useless. I don't think we can go toe-to-toe with anything that comes out to get us, so they're kind of only for when the fight spreads out towards us I suppose. Basically anything that can kill you is going to force you off the field (sneak preview of the ECM guide I'm furiously typing out: you are aligned while jamming. If anything targets you, warp out and bounce back in.) You are all likely better at multitasking than me, but to be honest, with the micromanagement that jamming requires, I rarely use my weapons. In fact, I'm positive I've activated remote reppers more times than I have weapons. Which leads me to almost consider bringing a high-rack full of armor and hull reppers rather than simply losing missile launchers and missiles...
This probably just highlights how bad I am at the game, but to me, it's the jamming that's critical, the DPS is an afterthought. And with the doctrine we're going to try to practice about being out at 70-90, well, there's not a lot out there to shoot at except each other. If there is, we best be in warp.
And I suck at multi-tasking, as do most people (including people who think they're good at multi-tasking.)
If we get enough ecm-squad people I think warping off just because you are yellow-boxed is a very poor idea. (It definitely should remind you to align asap, if you aren't already ofc.) By the time you warp off and warp back, the fight will in all likelihood be decided.
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11350-open-pvp-avanced-hssr-2300-15th-advanced-2100-for-16th-17th-july/]ADVANCED HSSR -1807102100[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11588-closed-pvp-wolfpacks-class-august-2829-1800/]WOLFPACKS-201008281800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/12728-fullpvp-covops-nov-28-1800-venue-changeread/]COVOPS - 281101800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13477-closed-pvp-skirmish-prototype-class-29th-30th-january-1300/]SKIRMISH-20110129[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13315-closed-pvp-flybys-february-12th-1800/]FLYBYS-20110212[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/16195-closed-stealth-bombers-20111119-2000/]Stealth Bombers 20111119[/link]
#34
Posted 21 October 2011 - 06:05 PM
If we get enough ecm-squad people I think warping off just because you are yellow-boxed is a very poor idea. (It definitely should remind you to align asap, if you aren't already ofc.) By the time you warp off and warp back, the fight will in all likelihood be decided.
This is one of the fun decisions when flying ECM. There are a lot of scraps that get decided quickly. On the other hand, there are fights like the Archon kill where I bounced repeatedly, and am convinced I was on the field longer than I would have been if I had not bounced and had to reship. It's a personal risk assessment thing My only real experience getting instapopped has been in a Griffin, so you may be right about having a little more tank in a cruiser. Then again, if we can maintain range I think we're only in targeting range of battleships maybe, and that's the one thing that can probably yellow-box me and force me out of dodge.
Another trick is to drop a BM as you're coming out of warp to land in a fight, or right as you leave grid, giving you a way to bounce out and back in around 45 seconds vs. the usual 75 it takes to get to and from an average-distance celestial.
Furthermore, we will hopefully have a TAM artist assigned to us. If we can get them to make us 2 on-grids (like you were suggesting), we can bounce between those at like under 15 seconds per warp
Raise your hand if you want to fly an interceptor and not intercept? We promise your cover won't be blown by getting on any pesky killmails...
#35
Posted 21 October 2011 - 06:12 PM
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11350-open-pvp-avanced-hssr-2300-15th-advanced-2100-for-16th-17th-july/]ADVANCED HSSR -1807102100[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11588-closed-pvp-wolfpacks-class-august-2829-1800/]WOLFPACKS-201008281800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/12728-fullpvp-covops-nov-28-1800-venue-changeread/]COVOPS - 281101800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13477-closed-pvp-skirmish-prototype-class-29th-30th-january-1300/]SKIRMISH-20110129[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13315-closed-pvp-flybys-february-12th-1800/]FLYBYS-20110212[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/16195-closed-stealth-bombers-20111119-2000/]Stealth Bombers 20111119[/link]
#36
Posted 21 October 2011 - 06:31 PM
#37
Posted 21 October 2011 - 08:17 PM
If not, I suggest trading some gank for some gank in whatever you're bringing.
#38
Posted 21 October 2011 - 08:36 PM
MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.
#39
Posted 21 October 2011 - 09:19 PM
Prudance Windstar, how would you like to join us out at 100 km in the ECM squad?
If not, I suggest trading some gank for some gank in whatever you're bringing.
Yeah...
#40
Posted 21 October 2011 - 09:44 PM
Prudance Windstar, how would you like to join us out at 100 km in the ECM squad?
If not, I suggest trading some gank for some gank in whatever you're bringing.
Yeah...
Yeah as in "great idea, sign me up for ECM," or yeah as in "I'm bringing a trimarked, plated ship with a dcu, resist modules and an oversized shield extender?"
#41
Posted 21 October 2011 - 10:34 PM
#42
Posted 21 October 2011 - 10:48 PM
#43
Posted 22 October 2011 - 12:19 AM