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Dec 13th - FeedBack

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#1 Caldak


Posted 14 December 2013 - 02:25 AM

Not too bad, smaller turnout than expected for class.

Not sure if Friday didn't work for folks in Au.


Roam, not too bad, the last fight in the end made up for it.

Anne Bonney, a notorious pirate in her own right, told her husband, Calico Jack Bonney, as he was captured by pirate hunters,
“if you'd have fought like a man you needn't hang like a dog”.

Done some class's

#2 Ichi Kamikaze

Ichi Kamikaze

Posted 14 December 2013 - 02:35 AM

The roam was AWESOME! Great fight at the end. Thank you Agony for a wonderful time :)

#3 Arusu

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 02:36 AM

Definitely not bad, that first fight where we whelped most of the fleet was pretty chaotic and gang with bigger guns and logi running away from us was pretty strange, but fast manouvers like that cane and drake killed near gates and last fight, where we managed to get down stabber, thorax, cyclone, vaga and cynabal made it a really great experience :D.

#4 Caldak


Posted 14 December 2013 - 02:58 AM

In the Frigate fight, we face 34 for our 21, They had T2 and Logi for there fleet.

We took out 3 for our 7 losses, so really good for throwing you into a fur ball to enjoy the experience. 

So how many applied Ewar as they started fighting ? But enjoying it is the thing we aimed at.

Anne Bonney, a notorious pirate in her own right, told her husband, Calico Jack Bonney, as he was captured by pirate hunters,
“if you'd have fought like a man you needn't hang like a dog”.

Done some class's

#5 Mara Rinn

Mara Rinn
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Posted 14 December 2013 - 03:04 AM

Thanks for an awesome outing! I have to step up my game since I lost my Griffin twice due to not warping out quickly enough.

  • Koldz (sp?) presented the theory course at a nice pace.
  • Caldak was great, even if we got confused a few times by his sheer aversion to using the J-word!
  • The tips along the way such as overview tanking were very useful.

Looking forward to the next AUTZ roams & classes!

#6 Rei Ayanami

Rei Ayanami
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Posted 14 December 2013 - 03:17 AM

Can't give much in terms of feedback on the class since I screwed up timing (thought it was 8pm not 8am), but the roam I had a blast in.  I learned a lot on a way a Fleet is run ini terms of compostiion and more importantly comms.


I lost two ships, the first one not sure what to have done but would at some point like to talk about the loss with someone from Agony to really learn from the mistake (Got killed by Crow from about 20k). The last kill was eve screwed up.  Caldax warped us to a TAC and then as he cold warped the fleet to a gate, it cold warped me back to the gate that was camped heavily.  I stood no chance.

#7 speart

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 04:03 AM

I learned an incredible amount.  My PvP experience up to date has been brief skirmishes while I was either mining or running missions.  I learned early on that I wasn't very good so always avoided it.  After last night's instruction I have less fear now and have actually ventured into low sec a few times solo.  I got pwnd in seconds flat, but I want to get used to dying (every other MMO I've played it's important to learn how to die before you can learn how to live :P).  I've been analyzing the fights and looking at where I didn't apply what I learned last night and hopefully I can get some more muscle memory.


I didn't participate in today's ROAM due to some logistical problems, but last nights exercise was fun.  As someone said before, many times at gates I didn't hear the words JUMP JUMP JUMP (as was expressly communicated in many of the links I read in preparation).  That led me to getting confused once and I got left behind but I was able to navigate through a field of baddies - again thanks to some of the stuff I learned - and warped out and joined the fleet with minor scratches.


Positive Feedback : Excellent classroom instruction.  Well organized FC and decent comm discipline (personally I violated once - hopefully after getting my butt handed to me a few times today in my solo ventures there'll be less pucker factor and I won't violate again with OMGFGZZ I'M PWNT! chatter if I attend another class in the future - sorry about that guys).

Areas for Improvement:  As mentioned before, more consistency with commands (especially for us newbs).  I'm sure once I get the hang of it and go with some crews I'll understand more the mechanics, but being new I was sometimes left guessing and hoping the action I did was correct.  For the most part I stayed with the fleet, other than one mistake on my part where I didn't warp to the leader in time and missed the jump command, so I think I got the hang of it, but it was bit scary at times.


Thank you for your time and sacrifice guys.  I know you can be out there pew-pewing, but instead you take the time out to help us learn a very valuable skillset in this game - especially if you want to see the entire universe and get out of highsec.  The tuition is negligible compared to what you sacrifice - including the occasional Agony ship that I'm sure gets popped in these ventures.  Because of that I see you guys more of a non-profit community service.  Thank you for that!

#8 Crompton

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 04:50 AM

This is the tale of

Two year old me

Who went to a fanference -

‘EDU’ in Sydney.


One of the speakers

A player I guessed

Spoke about Agony.

I think it was Quest.


“We teach players to play

To shoot and stay

Alive to fight

Another day


“Because you’re here

We can offer to you

A free PVP Basic

Just state EDU.”


I went out with Agony

 On their PVP roam

I was a nervous nelly

Leaving my home.


In PVP Basic

They’ve already shown

You’ll come back dead, so

Update your clone.


I did the pre-reading

Not much made sense

I stocked up on mods

And skills – that cost a ‘few’ cents.


We got into Stacmon

And did all the theory

By the time I hit bed

My brain was bleary.


Up the next morning

The roam started out

A recap on last night

"If you’ve questions just shout."


Throughout the journey

My muscles were terse

Before I knew it

We’d jumped into Curse.


The bad guys were elusive

Which suited me fine

Before in came some big ships

And targeted mine.


“Damp it, and point’ that”

The FC dude said.

He must have a million things

Going on in his head.


“X up in fleet

if you’re lagging behind”

“Don’t say the J word

or you will get fined.”


FC: “When your warp stops

Align with the Sun,

We’ll give it a minute

Then give them a run.”


“Words I might say are

Warp, scram and bubble

When I say scatter

You know we’re in trouble.”


At the end of the course

They said do a review.

Just answer the question

"How did we do?"


Not sure what the answer is

Too early to say

Whether I’ll risk

Returning one day.


As my head is still spinning

And my hands are a-shaking

It is scary stuff

These new thrills I am taking.


One thing is for sure

I increased more skills

Than if I’d been lazy

And not sought the kills.


I did lose two ships

But only one pod.

Replacing my clone

Was dearer than mods.


I got a great screen shot

Of me dangling in space

As my clone went express

To my medical place.


You can say it’s a win

When your lowly frigate

Leaves a Goonswarm victim!

You just have to dig it!

#9 Othran


Posted 14 December 2013 - 10:43 AM

Let's not go back to Provi again for it is a silly place. It just annoys the hell out of me because barring a miracle I know what will happen when class turns up - bugger all apart from a couple of ganks and they'll take ages to get as well :)


On the subject of being annoyed, I should have looted that damn Cynabal, was sitting on top of it when it popped. I have to start looting wrecks rather than assuming someone else is going to do it 

Today's word is :

MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.

#10 turtle1921

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 11:39 AM

Had a great time, Big thanks to Agony.


Appreciate the time that the Agony members put into the class and for Caldak and Cole tuition.


Really enjoyed the experience of seeing a fleet move through space with recon both from agony members and other utilities.  Enjoyed that everyone was learning on the roam including Agony.  Managed to get on 4 kill mails which are my first.  One of the toughest parts of the roam was to maintain situational awareness.  As a new player understanding the dynamics of not only the grid that you are on as well as the system and to a higher level of constellation and regions is a demanding task at this stage.  I take my hat off to the FC (Caldack) and his support.


I would highly recommend this class to anyone who is in the eve universe.  20mil ISK for 8-10hs of awesome gameplay is pittance compared to the enjoyment and learning you will receive.


Many thanks again

#11 Blake Aivoras

Blake Aivoras
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Posted 14 December 2013 - 11:40 AM

Caldak did a terrific job of both teaching andFCing. I have been on quite a few fleets and Caldak's approach really stands out; fast moving, focus on clear comms, strong leverage of scouts and decisive. If you stuff up it will may be preceded with "my dear" before he "corrects" :) I was also really impressed with how engaging the class was. It didn't feel like a lecture but rather an interactive lesson. I think it was Cole's (?) first time teaching the material. I didn't find his presentation as good as Caldak's but the bar is pretty high.


Moving from stacmon to berta was annoying but the offer of free freighter made it much easier. I'm not sure why we wouldn't have just had the class in Berta in the first place.


I now have an appreciation of the strengths and weakness of Hydra frigate fleets.

+ Inevitably going to win the ISK war

+ Leverages lots of low skilled pilots

+ Very mobile, easy to engage or disengage

+ Able to leverage lots of forward scouts (due to mobility)


- pretty low chance of surviving any individual encounter

- requires relatively inexperienced players to spread ewar effectively

- probably not the best doctrine for lots of mid/high skill pilots (wolfpacks....)


This has helped me understand that E-Uni has some mid tier instructors that can take us from nothing to decent skills but corps like Agony have 8 year players (Like Caldak) that are on a whole other level. The quality and reliability of the Agony scouts also made a substantial impact on our ability to find and take fights.


AU Timezone:

* In Perth - these times were not great (4pm on Friday and 5am on Saturday).

* I'm sorry that the turnout was so poor because the AU timezone doesn't get as much content in general


.... You do a great service to the eve community and I can't wait for the wolfpack class!


Cheers, Blake

#12 Othran


Posted 14 December 2013 - 12:15 PM

- pretty low chance of surviving any individual encounter


I wouldn't agree with that. It very much depends what you are flying in the basic fleet and your level of experience.


If you're scram fit then you are going to be right in the thick of it and you are going to have to be more aware of who's at a bounce tac/what has you pointed/scrammed. There are of course times when you think "sod it, I'm sticking until he goes down or I do" but as you gain experience you'll find that its not the death trap you think.


If you are point fit and are operating outside scram/web range then you've got a very good chance of surviving 90%+ of encounters on class. You just need to recognise when to stick and when to bounce, which will only come with experience.


If you are flying ewar (damps/ECM) then you're hopefully well out of point range anyway so you got no worries apart from hopping through gates or getting bubbled.


I tend to lose more ships on the basic roam than anything else because I don't fly the same way on basic as I do for other gangs/class roams. With basic you tend to push a bit harder and take fights you wouldn't normally take, simply to get the students some fun. As such I lose more stuff than normal, should have got my arse out of that first fight easy enough but the aforementioned "sod it...." attitude kicked in. That doesn't tend to happen when I run in smaller gangs as its just a waste of a ship most of the time, whereas in basic its one ship out of 50 so I can be a bit more irresponsible :D


There's at least one guy who came on every basic roam for years and didn't lose a single ship for 18 months+. Then again he did fit sebos and I wouldn't have trusted him to stick when needed ;)

Today's word is :

MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.

#13 Zunnta

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 07:29 PM

Thank you Agony for introducing me to PvP.


Special thanks to Caldak (who I thought was an awesome FC) & to Greygal (for acting as virtual fleet nanny for us students).  The other instructors were also very informative.


It was a shame that some of the students appeared not to have fully prepared for the class by reading the various material provided, as we lost a lot of time going over material that should already have been known.


There is a huge amount of information to digest in a relatively short space of time, but I think we students all left the class much wiser for the experience.  I now understand some of the mechanics of PvP & simply want to learn more.  I hope that you guys organise other classes in the near future for us Aussies - I will definitely be there.


Fly safe all.



#14 Caldak


Posted 15 December 2013 - 06:02 AM

Well here we go, this for time management.

Do the vote on the thread and I'll see what we can do for you......


Having a good second and third backup target calling FC is a must.

Quest should of stood out, main reason I just went with lock up and shoot at will then let him start calling targets in the first engagement was to give that OMG moment followed by

some structure in the fight. GreyGirl just oozed into place after he went down.


Eve is something else but as Othran said, we go out to get Pew Pew on a class, so you take fights that you know you going to loose because people come to class not only

to gank ( Think of the Drake ) but to take on bigger odds for the enjoyment of it. Its only ISK and a little 1's and 0's on a computer screen, Really it isn't your Pay check you throwing away.

Anne Bonney, a notorious pirate in her own right, told her husband, Calico Jack Bonney, as he was captured by pirate hunters,
“if you'd have fought like a man you needn't hang like a dog”.

Done some class's