[Feedback] PVP Basic December 7th/8th 2012 @ 20:00
#1
Posted 08 December 2012 - 07:55 AM
What you do for yourself dies with you, what you do for others is immortal.
BASIC | WOLFPACKS | ADVANCED | HSSR | EYES OF THE KILLER | STEALTH BOMBRS | FLYBYS | SKIRMISHING | INTERMEDIATE
The only chance you get is the one you take.
Redemption Road - Free Public Roams and Other Events!
Public Chat: Redemption Road - Mailing List: Redemption Roams
Roc’s Rule #286: A real friend never lets you do anything stupid … alone.
#2
Posted 08 December 2012 - 09:06 AM
#3
Posted 08 December 2012 - 09:17 AM
The most important thing you missed is standing fleet orders: When we land on a gate, hold on the gate (just orbit the gate at 500meters) - do NOT go through the gate until the FC orders it. We we go through a gate, hold cloak. That means, go through the gate and do not do anything at all until the FC orders it.
You also missed dscanning, voice communications, recon reporting (you'll hear plenty of examples of that during the roam), and an excellent after-class question-and-answers session!
Watch Azual's spiraling video to gain an understanding of spiraling. We don't use it much in the usual Basic class roam, but it is a good skill to know for soloing, skirmishing, small gang fights, and *gasp* sometimes even handy in missions!
If you don't have time for anything else before the roam, be sure to read the Voice Communications article I linked above
Do come on the roam! Looking forward to flying with you!
What you do for yourself dies with you, what you do for others is immortal.
BASIC | WOLFPACKS | ADVANCED | HSSR | EYES OF THE KILLER | STEALTH BOMBRS | FLYBYS | SKIRMISHING | INTERMEDIATE
The only chance you get is the one you take.
Redemption Road - Free Public Roams and Other Events!
Public Chat: Redemption Road - Mailing List: Redemption Roams
Roc’s Rule #286: A real friend never lets you do anything stupid … alone.
#4
Posted 08 December 2012 - 09:46 AM
#5
Posted 08 December 2012 - 12:09 PM
I've got 2 remarks though on what was said:
- When making safe spots, you explained people shouldn't rely on mid-safes, but use a mid and a celestial to make a better safe. You didn't explain that an even better way was to use 2 mids (but it is explained on the Wiki )
- (It's more the matter of an advanced class, but still)
We've been discussing how stealth bombers were making their runs, and I didn't agree quite totally with you. The steps you mentioned were: "align (while cloaked), uncloak, launch bomb, re-cloak, warp away". I just tested that tactic, and as I remembered, you have a re-cloaking delay for bombers, which is about 14 seconds. Thus, if you want to be "on the field" the least time possible, you should align (while cloaked), uncloak, launch bomb, warp and while in warp re-cloak. Am I doing something wrong?
- Using the word "Recon" for +1's, so that the FC is actually listening to the report (in E-Uni, comms are sometimes really confused )
- Which ewar module to use, when, and especially WHY (understanding the reason is more valuable than getting flat info on that)
- Listening to women, and following their orders...
See you later, and continue the great job.
Fly deadly o7
#6
Posted 08 December 2012 - 01:36 PM
Thanks for the class, it was long, but valuable!
I've got 2 remarks though on what was said:On the other hand, I learned a few things:
- When making safe spots, you explained people shouldn't rely on mid-safes, but use a mid and a celestial to make a better safe. You didn't explain that an even better way was to use 2 mids (but it is explained on the Wiki )
- (It's more the matter of an advanced class, but still)
We've been discussing how stealth bombers were making their runs, and I didn't agree quite totally with you. The steps you mentioned were: "align (while cloaked), uncloak, launch bomb, re-cloak, warp away". I just tested that tactic, and as I remembered, you have a re-cloaking delay for bombers, which is about 14 seconds. Thus, if you want to be "on the field" the least time possible, you should align (while cloaked), uncloak, launch bomb, warp and while in warp re-cloak. Am I doing something wrong?I really enjoyed the time (eventhough it was 2am at the end for me) and am looking forward to the roam!
- Using the word "Recon" for +1's, so that the FC is actually listening to the report (in E-Uni, comms are sometimes really confused )
- Which ewar module to use, when, and especially WHY (understanding the reason is more valuable than getting flat info on that)
- Listening to women, and following their orders...
See you later, and continue the great job.
Fly deadly o7
Glad you enjoyed the class - I wasn't there but I hope to be for the roam...
1) To be honest a mid-celestial safe isn't much more likely to be busted than a mid-mid safe. It's fine to make them either way really.
2) You are correct that you should get into warp as soon as possible after a bombing run. You may not even be able to recloak (at all) as other bombers might be within 2km.
Just a minor additional point: "Recon" is used for all scouts and skirmishers, not just +1s. This may have been what you meant, but just wanted to clarify.
#7
Posted 08 December 2012 - 01:46 PM
- Listening to women, and following their orders...
Clearly never been married then
MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.
#8
Posted 08 December 2012 - 02:03 PM
I always get the last say when arguing with my wife...
- Listening to women, and following their orders... :P/>
Clearly never been married then :P/>
Ofc, it's usually 'yes, dear'.
[20:58:13] CCP Unifex > loving the Tweed thing
#9
Posted 08 December 2012 - 02:52 PM
#10
Posted 08 December 2012 - 04:01 PM
I always get the last say when arguing with my wife...
Ofc, it's usually 'yes, dear'.
I don't bother arguing much now. Even when I "win" it turns out that in fact everything I remember from the previous day is in fact complete bollox and she was right
If I'm going to do something/buy something I just do it and deal with the fallout later - which is why we have gigE connections in every room in the house (bar bathrooms/kitchen etc) and can stream Sky/Freesat/Freeview/downloaded stuff around the house at will
Here's hoping for a fun roam...
MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.
#11
Posted 09 December 2012 - 12:58 PM
#12
Posted 09 December 2012 - 02:06 PM
ALUMNI
PvP Basic Class: PVP-BASIC 20121117 (as Steven Koskanaiken)
Wolfpacks Class: WOLFPACKS-20140216 (as J'Poll)
#13
Posted 09 December 2012 - 03:07 PM
Just a note on your griffin fit.
at the end of the fitting it states:
Alternatively, you may drop the Dispersion Projector rigs for a second Dispersion Augmentor rig (but be aware of how much that will reduce your jammer's optimal)
its not possible to fit 2 augmentor rigs and 1 dispersion due to calibration. so its either the suggested fit or only 2 augmentor and a free rig slot.
#14
Posted 09 December 2012 - 03:23 PM
great as allways.
Just a note on your griffin fit.
at the end of the fitting it states:
Alternatively, you may drop the Dispersion Projector rigs for a second Dispersion Augmentor rig (but be aware of how much that will reduce your jammer's optimal)
its not possible to fit 2 augmentor rigs and 1 dispersion due to calibration. so its either the suggested fit or only 2 augmentor and a free rig slot.
Note use of plural
BASIC-20100220 WOLFPACKS-1203102200
Watch me paste this pathetic palooka with a powerful, paralyzing, poifect, pachydoimous, percussion pitch.
#15
Posted 09 December 2012 - 03:58 PM
ALUMNI
PvP Basic Class: PVP-BASIC 20121117 (as Steven Koskanaiken)
Wolfpacks Class: WOLFPACKS-20140216 (as J'Poll)
#16
Posted 09 December 2012 - 04:46 PM
great as allways.
Just a note on your griffin fit.
at the end of the fitting it states:
Alternatively, you may drop the Dispersion Projector rigs for a second Dispersion Augmentor rig (but be aware of how much that will reduce your jammer's optimal)
its not possible to fit 2 augmentor rigs and 1 dispersion due to calibration. so its either the suggested fit or only 2 augmentor and a free rig slot.
Note use of plural
Right. I read 3 rigs, my bad
#17
Posted 09 December 2012 - 05:20 PM
#18
Posted 09 December 2012 - 05:43 PM
What is agonys, if any, thoughts on the use of jamming ships, now that the new ECCM skills has arrived.
I could imagine them becoming obselete in the future, but probably too soon to say.
Assuming the target has his comps trained to a decent level, his sensor strength will be 20-25% better, so it depends on the ship. That said, if it was easy to jam before, it'll still be reasonably easy to jam now, only slightly less so.
BASIC-20100220 WOLFPACKS-1203102200
Watch me paste this pathetic palooka with a powerful, paralyzing, poifect, pachydoimous, percussion pitch.
#19
Posted 09 December 2012 - 06:06 PM
Of course it is ze 16-20% improved strength zat Deran is talking aboutAssuming the target has his comps trained to a decent level, his sensor strength will be 20-25% better[..]
#20
Posted 09 December 2012 - 07:17 PM
On bombing runs: If alumni are going to be responsible for fending off bombers, we should be especially encouraged to fit long range (you're never going to hit any but the most fail bombers with autocannons, at least not before the bomb goes off.) Nothing shreds bombers like a few skilled pilots with 250mm (my weapon of choice) or 280mm arty and a TE or 2 (my current fit has 2 TE (instead of a 2nd gyro) both so I can kill bombers better and so I can fit a 2nd EWAR because I'm all about the team and stuff.)
I ended the roam stuck in VOL after I escaped the last bombing run in half structure. I tried sneaking home after the euro folks (and some of the US folks) had gone to bed and jumped into Los (with a couple of buddies) in a dictor on the Doril side of Doril/Jorund. I was resigned to losing my ship but was hoping to get my pod out. I powered back to the gate and made my first mistake by jumping through. I should have tried warping off to force him to get aggression. He followed me through and I made my 2nd mistake by trying to get into warp before he could get a bubble up instead of getting my bearings. My heart dropped when my warp drive shut down and my speed dropped. All I could do now was click randomly and power up my MWD and pray. His buddies started to dribble in as I overheated the MWD before the 2nd cycle. I was clear for now and saw a celestial I thought was pretty much in line with my direction and warped to it at 50. My ship slowed and veered drastically and I realized it hadn't been as lined up as I had thought (3rd mistake.) Hoping against hope that I hadn't slowed enough to allow my pursuers to catch me, my prayers were soon answered and I was in warp. Once I landed I hit warp to a safespot and relaxed a bit (4th mistake.) About 5 seconds later I realized that that warp hadn't been initiated and I saw Los landing on grid. Oh shit. I warped to the safespot again and made my final prayer, that he had warped at 100 or 0. Sure enough, he'd warped at 0 and I was finally safe. Adrenaline rush for the day achieved.
Ironically I logged in today with 50,000 logged in and 2 quick uneventful hops followed and I was safe in Sendaya.
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11350-open-pvp-avanced-hssr-2300-15th-advanced-2100-for-16th-17th-july/]ADVANCED HSSR -1807102100[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/11588-closed-pvp-wolfpacks-class-august-2829-1800/]WOLFPACKS-201008281800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/12728-fullpvp-covops-nov-28-1800-venue-changeread/]COVOPS - 281101800[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13477-closed-pvp-skirmish-prototype-class-29th-30th-january-1300/]SKIRMISH-20110129[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/13315-closed-pvp-flybys-february-12th-1800/]FLYBYS-20110212[/link]
[link=http://www.agony-unleashed.com/index.php?/topic/16195-closed-stealth-bombers-20111119-2000/]Stealth Bombers 20111119[/link]
#21
Posted 09 December 2012 - 07:52 PM
Of course it is ze 16-20% improved strength zat Deran is talking aboutAssuming the target has his comps trained to a decent level, his sensor strength will be 20-25% better[..]
What is this Eve thing again?
BASIC-20100220 WOLFPACKS-1203102200
Watch me paste this pathetic palooka with a powerful, paralyzing, poifect, pachydoimous, percussion pitch.
#22
Posted 10 December 2012 - 12:00 AM
ALUMNI
PvP Basic Class: PVP-BASIC 20121117 (as Steven Koskanaiken)
Wolfpacks Class: WOLFPACKS-20140216 (as J'Poll)
#23
Posted 10 December 2012 - 02:56 AM
As a result establishing a proper roam was difficult especially when we needed to evade 120-150 RvB fleet flying in the same area (plus a few others FA, NC-dot etc.) . Anyways we got some nice kills, most of us died a few times and we had a fine slug at the end with RvB guys.
All in all a proper 0.0 experience, and although at the end I was completely exhausted, it was a rewarding experience four your humble FC. Also in spite of all the madness going on, the fleet comms were excellent, the movement fast and no unauthorised jumps, so props to you guys, well done!
It is an interesting suggestion and we may consider a proper anti-bombing fits. As you say Arty with a high alpha is perfect for this, but also a Sebo and TE is quite useful to be able to apply damage quickly. The problem is that with a hydra fleet you compromise a lot by having a specific anti-bomber setup and while it would be good for that one use, we would be disadvantaged in other situations.On bombing runs: If alumni are going to be responsible for fending off bombers, we should be especially encouraged to fit long range (you're never going to hit any but the most fail bombers with autocannons, at least not before the bomb goes off.) Nothing shreds bombers like a few skilled pilots with 250mm (my weapon of choice) or 280mm arty and a TE or 2 (my current fit has 2 TE (instead of a 2nd gyro) both so I can kill bombers better and so I can fit a 2nd EWAR because I'm all about the team and stuff.)
Having said that, having on standby an anti-bomb fit could be a lot of fun as well.
On a side note, DCU + MSE on my Merlin made me survive all the bombing attacks, and while depending on ones skills it may not be for everybody possible to fit such a tanky ship, it is probably worth considering when joining on the next Alumni roam.
#24
Posted 10 December 2012 - 08:35 AM
On the new eccm comp skills, it looks like it rounds down (truncates)? I trained mine to 4 for minmatar and was disappointed that my sensor strength only went from 11 to 12 (I'll have to train it to V to get to 13 I guess.)
It rounds down on the fitting screen (it's an integer field and Python rounds decimals down by default when you convert to int) but if you do a "show info" on your ship then you will see the correct value.
MORAL, adj. Conforming to a local and mutable standard of right. Having the quality of general expediency.
#25
Posted 10 December 2012 - 08:41 AM