18 replies to this topic

[Barfbeard]

ok, given the useage of bombs seems to be limited, I was dissapointed that tossing a bomb into the middle of the beginner class did not kill at least one. Was it the fact that they were all moving? Thinking this through, later on I tossed another bomb into the class. yet again failing to kill even one of them. Has bomb damage been made so small it cannot even kill a frigate? Any insight into this would be helpful. Barfbeard

[DaDutchDude]

Bomb damage is related to the signature radius of the target, not to its speed. With max skills, a bomb can potentially do 8000 damage. However, is has an explosion radius of 400 meters (again, max skills, worse with lower skills), meaning that targets with smaller radii will receive less damage. This makes bombs most effective in larger numbers and against bigger targets, which it was intended for. Hope that clears things up. Edit: the damage formula (which I stole from another thread) should be something like this: [blockquote]Damage = Bomb Damage x min ( (ship sig / bomb explosion radius) , 1)[/blockquote] With a max skilled CovOps pilots and an AB fitted rifter (without mods that increase sig radius), this would give: [blockquote]Damage = 8000 x min((35 / 400), 1) = 8000 x 0,0875 = 700[/blockquote] The actual damage then depends on the resist the bomb hits, but most of the time, 1 bomb shouldn't kill a frig unless it is using MWD. Edit 2: A pro tip: You can kill some ships with a single bomb, but you often have to trick them into it. Decloaking out of bomb range will often have people power toward you with MWD on. If you time it well and have a nice align out point, you can throw your bomb early and warp off while they power into the bombs blast radius just as it explodes. With their added sig radius because of their MWD, you'll easily pop frigs and destroyers and have a good chance of popping Assault Frigs (lost a Harpy myself that way) and Interdictors (killed 2 Sabres myself). Interceptors are usually too fast for this, and cruisers / HACs / Recons / etc are too tough for just one bomb. Another good target for a solo bomber are industrials. You can bomb them on station if they make a mistake. If they don't use an insta-undock and don't wait out their 'redock timer' before aligning, you can sometimes get them before they warp off or have a chance to dock. I have also successfully bombed a Transport ship that was building a POS, but chances like those are very rare.

[Azual]

Bomb damage is affected solely by the sig radius of the target. Speed is not a factor. This means that due to the low sig radius of a frigate, a single bomb will not kill a frigate unless it is running a MWD when hit. Should you hit a target who is running a MWD, a single bomb has been known to kill frigates, destroyers, and some lightly tanked cruisers. An effective bomber strike in most circumstances requires multiple bombers (using the same type of bomb since bombs have great resistance to their own damage type and thus this avoids them blowing each other up). However, when coordinated in this fashion, a bomber wing can be incredibly effective, as well as almost untouchable when flown right.

[Alistone Malikite]

According to the PVPU Killboard Cr8rmaker lost his raptor (interceptor) to a shrapnel bomb. Apparently he got caught with his MWD on.

[cr8r]

yup, was already lit to speed to the tackle of something on gate when i heard bomb. Couldn't move off in time once i heard bomb in the air, and even deactivating wouldn't have saved me due to cycle time.

[Barfbeard]

ok, so speed has nothing to do with avoiding explosion. it is solely signature? seems strange that there are skills to increase damage against higher velocity targets. So basically if I am understanding correctly it doesnt make any difference if you are moving or not against a bomb as it is solely signature correct? Barfbeard And thank you , even though several of you have been my training targets as of late, this information helps.

[Hogun Rath]

ok, so speed has nothing to do with avoiding explosion. it is solely signature? seems strange that there are skills to increase damage against higher velocity targets. So basically if I am understanding correctly it doesnt make any difference if you are moving or not against a bomb as it is solely signature correct?

Barfbeard

And thank you , even though several of you have been my training targets as of late, this information helps.

For a bomb the velocity of the target is irrelevant as others pointed out. The skills you are mentioning affect missiles and not bombs. Missile damage depends on the speed of the target.

[Barfbeard]

Thank you for clearing this up. I will start working on several different bomber fits then until i find one I do like for solo work. Barfbeard

[Esbear]

Bombs also do very well against industrials and covops usually killing them with just one bomb. Solo bombing is not the best way to go about bombing stuff. Stealth bombers are not the most efficient solo ships. They are great for added dps in plenty of situations though.

[Baka Lakadaka]

Speed is only important for avoiding bomb damage if it's used to remove your ship from the blast radius. Moving quickly away from the bomb's detonation point is the most effective means of avoiding bomb damage, but it's all or nothing - you're either in blast radius or you're not. If you're close to the bomber, move towards him - the bomb will pass you and explode behind. If you're near the detonation point, move as quickly as possible in any direction away from the blast centre. If you're far away from the bomber, move away from the bomber and the bomb may not catch up to you. Of course making the bomber primary and removing him will prevent the bomb detonating at all.

[Barfbeard]

so, if you warp away before the bomb detonates, does the bomb still go off?

[vRava]

Yes, if you warp off, bomb still goes boom.

[Baka Lakadaka]

A session change for the bomber will kill a bomb before it detonates - so getting killed, jumping through a gate or docking up will cause the bomb to fail. I've never actually tested fleet changes, which can cause a session change - but, to be safe, I wouldn't go making changes to fleet while I've got a bomb in the air.

[Alistone Malikite]

Bombers could fit sensor boosters and fire a salvo of torps at the same time as launching a bomb... why have I never seen this? The added damage could make them much more effective against medium/large ships...especially ones standing still. (especially if they used EM torps to take out shields followed by an explosive bomb or vice versa and EMP bomb followed with explosive torps)

[Aether]

Bombers could fit sensor boosters and fire a salvo of torps at the same time as launching a bomb... why have I never seen this?

I've seen it described before, and taken a step further for soloing larger ships in a bomber: perma-mwding-bombing-torping-SBs

He claims to have killed around 70 ratting baltteships with it, by first throwing a bomb at them then taking them down with torpedoes, with element of surprise being on his side cuz nobody really expects to be attacked by a lone bomber. He also lists afterburning frigates among bad targets to try an take on (for reasons already covered).

[Stein Voorhees]

yup, was already lit to speed to the tackle of something on gate when i heard bomb. Couldn't move off in time once i heard bomb in the air, and even deactivating wouldn't have saved me due to cycle time.

Given a 10 sec flight time on a bomb and a 10 sec cycle on a MWD, it's worth just switching your MWD off as soon as you hear bomb as a lot of the time it will deactivate before the bombs goes off. Not every time but what do you have to lose?

[Baka Lakadaka]

Bombers could fit sensor boosters and fire a salvo of torps at the same time as launching a bomb... why have I never seen this? The added damage could make them much more effective against medium/large ships...especially ones standing still. (especially if they used EM torps to take out shields followed by an explosive bomb or vice versa and EMP bomb followed with explosive torps)

I'm not sure of exactly how to time this, but the torps would need to hit before the bomb exploded - otherwise you'd probably kill the torps.

Second salvo of torps would have to be timed to be outside the blast radius, or possibly even fired after bomb detonation for the same reason.

[Alistone Malikite]

Even with my pathetic missile skills my torps travel slightly faster than a bomb => with 3x sensor boosters I can lock a BS in .4 seconds. With better skills or rigs it would be easy to get torps to travel 1.5-2x as fast as a bomb. But yes... I realized after the post that the torps would likely need to hit first in order to avoid the "smartbombing BS torp defense" effect of the bomb going off. If you fire your bomb followed 1second later (after lock) by your torps then the duration on your torp launcher should be just about perfect so your 2nd volley would only be launching as/after the bomb explodes. But that's only if you're brave enough to stick around for 2 volleys (I don't have experience at this yet so I'd stick to 1 for now...) I really hope to have some fun with some gate camps in 2-3 man gangs of stealth bombers. I just learned covops skill last Thursday.

[Hogun Rath]

When you are there to launch bombs you most likely do not want to stick around. So you align, decloak, launch bomb, warp out. You do not waste time on locking targets and launching torps, neither will you stick around to check the effect of your bomb. You will return cloaked to check the field. Lots of ships can alpha you meaning that when you see the yellow bracket indicating a lock means you are already dead and need to worry about your pod. Just as that article explains about solo bomber kills, target selection is a great part of flying a bomber. You go around cloaked, get the intel on your targets, choose the right moment and strike.